Amy Duggar King shares what she wants Josh Duggar's wife to know and her hopes for 'Shiny Happy People' season 2: 'Love isn't trauma'

• Amy Duggar King says she has "no words" left for her cousin, convicted criminal Josh Duggar.
• She also wants Josh's wife Anna Duggar to know that "love isn't trauma." 
• King spoke with Insider about participating in the doc "Shiny Happy People" and growing up adjacent to IBLP.

Amy Duggar King is unbothered by being labeled a "rebel" Christian.

The 36-year-old grew up on television like her cousins, thanks to TLC's "19 Kids and Counting." The reality show, which aired from 2008 to 2015, starred her uncle Jim Bob Duggar, his wife Michelle, and their ever-growing brood of children. It also chronicled their lives under the strict rules of a Christian organization called the Institute of Basic Life Principals (IBLP).

But King, the only daughter of Jim Bob's older sister Deanna Jordan, didn't grow up in the IBLP herself and only had a guest-starring role on the original series. Unlike the other Duggar girls, King was allowed to wear pants. She could kiss boys before marriage and even attended a live concert where she watched Britney Spears sing, dance, and put a snake around her neck.

All of these activities were fairly typical of children growing up in the early 2000s, but they were forbidden under the rules of the IBLP, according to the TLC series and Jinger Vuolo's book, "Becoming Free Indeed." 

Despite their differences, King only began speaking out against her uncle Jim Bob's family in 2015 when she learned through InTouch Weekly's report that her cousin Josh Duggar had been accused of sexually abusing four of his sisters between 2002 and 2003 when he was a teenager and his sisters ranged in age from five to 11 years old.

Josh was never charged in relation to the sexual abuse allegations, though he issued an apology for his actions in 2015, saying he "acted inexcusably." But in May 2022, he was sentenced to 12 years and seven months in prison after being convicted on separate child pornography charges. (Josh pleaded not guilty to the charges and hasn't issued a public statement regarding his sentencing or conviction.)

King, who recently spoke out about confronting Josh after learning about the alleged molestation in 2015, has not held back on publicly criticizing Josh and the other Duggars in the years since. She issued a statement following Josh's 2022 sentencing saying that she could "sleep for the first time ever" knowing he was in prison.

The new docuseries "Shiny Happy People," streaming now on Prime Video, provided King with a rare, cathartic opportunity to speak out on a bigger platform against the institution of the IBLP that indoctrinated her family members. In the four-part series, which also featured interviews with IBLP survivors like King's cousin, Jill Dillard, King opened up about her experiences growing up with IBLP relatives, from the Duggar family's Disney-burning bonfire to seeing the pantaloons her female cousins were made to wear under their dresses.

Speaking to Insider after the docuseries' premiere in June, King is bright, bubbly, and quick to support victims of the IBLP who are now speaking out about the organization, including Dillard and Vuolo. She also shared what she wants Josh's wife Anna Duggar to know, whether she ever feared being around her aunt and uncle as a child, and how she feels about their response to "Shiny Happy People."

King said she was 'fearful' at times when she visited her aunt and uncle's house

You were a memorable guest star on TLC's "19 Kids and Counting," but you didn't grow up in the IBLP. What made you participate in "Shiny Happy People?" 

The IBLP made it seem from an outside perspective, like "Wow, these people seem like they have their stuff together." They seem like there's no fights, there's no problems, there's no drama. But perfection is something you can never really get to. It's a level that doesn't exist. I'm just excited that all of these families and the IBLP survivors feel validated that abuse did take place, but also to see that no one is perfect. 

I do believe that IBLP is a cult. It's just so sad that in this case, the IBLP used the Lord's name as a cover. Not every Christian is like that. I am strong in my faith. I've always been strong in my faith, and I just know that as humans, we completely fail. And IBLP members failed their children, but that doesn't mean all Christians are like that. Sometimes it's OK to be a rebel.

Growing up with your cousins, did you ever attend an IBLP event and experience any type of abuse like what was described in "Shiny Happy People?"

I went to a vacation Bible school in fourth or fifth grade. In order to leave, you had to recite scripture word for word to the teacher. And I was one of the last kids to leave because I was like, "Why do I have to memorize this scripture?" It's different if I want to memorize a Bible scripture from my heart and for something that I want in my head. But it's another if you're going to use scripture as a tool to keep kids locked in a room.

I got really nervous because I couldn't leave and get to my mom because I didn't know the scripture well enough. I'd never seen anyone use Bible scripture as a tool or a weapon.

Your cousin Jill Duggar Dillard said in "Shiny Happy People" that neither set of her grandparents understood why her mother and father were having so many children. From your perspective at family gatherings, what would your grandparents say?

My grandma would just be like, "Whoa, whoa, that's a lot." And then my grandpa — he was way more outspoken and he had an anger issue. He said what was on his mind. My aunt and uncle would be like, "We're pregnant with number 15." And my grandpa would be like, "All right. And that's it." So it was like a running joke. He loved his grandkids, though.

One of the most compelling parts of the documentary was when you and other subjects explained how discipline worked in the IBLP and that spanking a child, sometimes with objects, was called "encouragement." Was there any time you felt fearful for your safety while visiting your Uncle Jim Bob and Aunt Michelle?

I might be writing a book, so I want to keep some of my stories for that.

But I will say yes, there were times that I was fearful. It's interesting — I've never heard my aunt yell, not one time in her entire life have I ever heard her yell. But the reflection of her voice, and how calm and sweet she is with that whole tone, it doesn't match the experience of what could have been taking place.

On a bit of a lighter note, in the series, you mentioned that your cousins once told you about a bonfire they had burning Disney items. Did you go to that bonfire or do you have memories of talking about Disney or popular culture with them? 

Disney wasn't something that I could bring up. It was just really, really frowned upon. I wasn't there for the bonfire because I thought it was really freaky if I'm going to be honest. I thought it was really extreme, but I do remember they asked me if I had wanted to burn anything, and I was like, "What is happening? Why, why?"

King has 'no words' left for her cousin Josh

Do you have anything to say to your aunt and uncle, especially after they released a statement calling "Shiny Happy People" a "derogatory" series? 

I wish they would've mentioned the survivors, the people that actually went through hell and back, the people that had their spirits broken. This is their time to reflect and acknowledge their pain and they didn't.

And do you have anything to say to Josh following his conviction and sentencing? 

No. There are no words, honestly. Here's my thing: Anyone that can hurt a child like that, in the Bible it says it's better to hang a millstone around your neck and to be thrown into the depths of the sea.

I know you previously told People that there's a room for Josh's wife Anna at your house if she needs it. Do you have anything else you want to say to her or a message you hope she gets if she watches "Shiny Happy People?" 

Love doesn't hurt like this. Love doesn't hurt. Love doesn't control. Love isn't trauma, OK? That's not the way it's supposed to be. And so I hope her eyes are opened and I'm praying that the truth will be revealed to her.

"Shiny Happy People" is very detailed, but do you think there is more to be uncovered about the IBLP and your Uncle Jim Bob's family? 

Listen, I think a season two is coming. I haven't heard if a season two is coming, but I really truly hope so, because you can dive deep.

Like, how did Josh get to this point? What has happened to Josh? I don't know if those questions will ever be answered, but it's not just Josh. There are so many people who have struggled in the IBLP. It's not just the Duggars. That's just what people know of.

What are some experiences you think your cousins missed out on because of their IBLP upbringing? What do you wish they could've experienced? 

A concert would be amazing. Going to a waterpark, wearing a regular bathing suit. They've never gone to a movie, haven't had a cocktail. The ones that are older… hello, you haven't even had a margarita!

I just hope that they'd get to experience life and have it in abundance. You can know Jesus and still have freedom. I think if God was here right now, he'd have a margarita with me and say, "What is this nonsense? This is crazy."

This conversation has been edited and condensed for clarity.

"Shiny Happy People" is streaming now on Prime Video.